Resources Mentioned:

https://www.dayo.co/

Use code: HSH for a free month trial

Hillary Wilkinson: (00: 02)

As the CEO and co-founder of Dayo, an app that lets parents pay their teens to use their phones less. My guest today is turning screen time limits from a source of conflict for families into a shared financial incentive. Now, what I know about motivation is, is that it comes in many forms, , and I have, I have one child who was completely not incentivized at all by money, and another one who combed the neighborhood, looking for jobs. I'm very well aware that as many families who listen to this podcast will have as many varieties of kids on that motivational scale. And so we wanna provide a variety of tactics to approach family solutions. . Okay. I'm really, I'm very interested to learn more about this one. Welcome to Healthy Screen Habits, Corey Scholibo.

Corey Scholibo: (01:06)

Thanks for having me, Hillary. I'm happy to be here.

Hillary Wilkinson: (01:09)

Corey, you have created several successful companies in a variety of fields. Everything from plastic waste to women's health. Thank you so much. We don't have enough of that. And, um, what compelled you to enter the pond of digital wellness?

Corey Scholibo: (01:28)

Yeah, so, um, I, as you said, I did, I built a few companies and, and they're all mission-based. So as an entrepreneur, uh, for my financial detriment and my mental wellbeing, I can't get outta bed and sell something unless it has some sort of added value to culture. Um, it's how I sort of participate in culture at large. I, I don't run a nonprofit. I don't run for office. Those are all great, viable ways to affect change. To me, businesses can have an effect on our culture and on our society. And if you're going to do something for money in our capitalistic society, you could do something for good as opposed to something for negative. So, but the way I think about it is that I'm always looking for what I call the thing behind the thing, right? So, ultimately, I was very compelled.

Corey Scholibo: (02:12)

I was in the LGBT rights movement. I was working at a magazine called The Advocate, and I'm like, well, it's not really gonna matter if we have rights, if there's no planet. And so that sort of led me to the plastic pollution solution. And then, you know, when this, the opportunity came up in midlife, women menopause specifically, uh, we were incubated by Johnson and Johnson and, and they had said, you know, we want to, to help women in midlife. We don't know what to do. We sort of solved that puzzle for them with this company called While. But what I realized there was that about 50% of women for about 50% of their life were being unserved and were kind of sitting on the bench. They weren't really, some of them were literally falling outta the workplace. And I won't get into this whole topic, but to me, okay, that's a mission behind a mission.

Corey Scholibo: (02:54)

We can't save democracy. We can't save the planet if we don't have some of our best and brightest out in there fighting. And that was a really great mission. And then ultimately as part of that, this, you know, the attention economy was getting more named and more, uh, studied. And I was reading books about it, and to me, I was like, oh, this is the thing behind the thing. Like, we can't have anything if we can’t agree on a shared reality, if we're swimming in misinformation. And more importantly, I mean, this is what we've been reading about since we were kids, you know, that these tech companies would create products that take over our brains, take over our world, and it's here, it's happening. And so, as a mission-based entrepreneur, I couldn't think of anything bigger. And it just, it just got my, got my juices flowing and I jumped in.

Hillary Wilkinson: (03:37)

Well, thank you. I'm very grateful you're here. , , You mentioned, um, the attention and economy. Mm-hmm . And Dayo is kind of an app that, as I understand it, and that's why you're here, is to tell me if I've got this right. But it's kind of an app designed for the age of attention. Yes. And I'm wondering if you can explain what, what does it do to motivate kids to stay off devices or platforms that have had, you mentioned the best and the brightest? I mean, we're talking the most brilliant brains who have designed them to, to extract as much attention as possible

Corey Scholibo: (04:18)

Mm-hmm . Yeah. I mean, obviously you, you guys are well-versed in the subject matter. So I don't need to remind you that, you know, Jack Dorsey doesn't let his kid use Twitter. And you know, they all know they built the bomb, and they all don't keep their kids insulated from it, but don't keep your kids insulated from it. Um, and it's based on dopamine hijacking, right? We're creating dopamine cycles with likes and comments and shares and infinite scrolling. And so we really looked at that as the primary issue, not so much the tech, I mean the technology itself, but the tech. What is the technology doing in the brain? What is it offering you? Um, and, and it's in the form of the dopamine hit. So what would be a dopamine alternative? So for instance, if you want to quit drinking wine every night, like many of us did during COVID, um, you know, you don't just stop drinking wine.

Corey Scholibo: (05:01)

You're like, I started buying sparkling water and drinking sparkling water. Instead, you find these substitutes that give you some sort of replacement dopamine, for lack of a better word. And it's a well established psychological technique. It's called contingency management. There's nothing rocket science about it. And it's also based on, it's something that you do every day. You fly the same airline probably to get rewards from them. You maybe go to the same smoothie bar to get your free smoothie at the end of the week. Um, your insurance company will pay you to join a gym. Um, this is a well-established concept. So that's what I really wanted to use their own technology essentially against them. But when you get to the root of what all of these dopamine cycles are, they're very often just money. Right? At the end of the day, that is a, a very obvious and clear dopamine response that most of us have.

Corey Scholibo: (05:47)

And then most of us go to work to earn money anyway, in a time management situation. We could argue the faults of capitalism, but that's not really what I'm here to do. We live in a capitalistic society and we learn, or we learned as older people, time, money management, and how to do that. These kids are not being taught that because their time doesn't even exist. It's like in a vortex of nothingness. And they, um, you know, potentially have even harder time finding cash flow, right? As jobs become difficult, I've been hearing from so many teens that they can't even get a summer job. I'm like, really? You can't get a summer job? I mean, I could get any summer job. They weren't great, but they were there. Um, so we started out originally as, as trying to help, uh, people like you and I, and we created a marketplace of brands and services that would essentially offer you wholesale pricing.

Corey Scholibo: (06:33)

And you were to earn points towards discounts in the process of that, everyone was like, " This is great and all, and I love this, but what about my kids? What about my kids? What about my kids?” That's all I heard from every interviewer, every subject matter expert, every, you know, customer. And so we realized we could cut straight through this by cutting out a lot of the, the points and the nature and just let parents pay their kids. The example I give is when I was eight, my mother gave me $20 to quit sucking my thumb, 'cause she couldn't get me to quit sucking my thumb. This was probably 1985, by the way. So $20 is a little bit different.

Corey Scholibo: (07:13)

Um, and it worked, right? And these things work. There was a study that recently came out where meth addicts were being paid $30 a week for clean urine. And it was proven to work at two times therapy alone. Right? So it's not to say that therapy isn't important. It's not to say that parenting is off the table. You still have to parent. What we're offering is like a break in the technology. Um, something to help them get out of the space into the concept of changing their behavior, to which you can then, you know, parent. And so ultimately you put cash rewards on, on the line. What we've found from teens is that they, um, suddenly pay attention to their screen time, right? So the main issue is that, by the way, your apple phone, as we all know, can do this right now. It can send you an alert that tells you you set a limit for 20 minutes.

Corey Scholibo: (08:00)

No one listens to it. Everyone just scrolls through. And we're like, why? Because there's no carrot and there's no stick. And so we wanted to build both. And the way it works is the teen, let's say you have a deal with your teen for a week, for 50 bucks every day. They have, let's say you set the limit at two hours a day. Um, every day when they get to two hours, they get to choose to keep going. This is not a block in a band. Teens will not be blocked and they will not be banned. And I think anyone trying to do that is going to lose the battle. And I think that's what we've been trying to do. Right? Take the kids model, like the Barks for eight-year-olds. Yes. Push a button to close Instagram. You can't do that to a 16-year-old.

Corey Scholibo: (08:37)

And even if you could, what have they learned? Are they learning how to self-regulate? No. So to, um, to set that model. And then at the moment they're like, I have a choice to make now between earning money or continuing to scroll, if they keep scrolling, they lose the money and it goes back into the parent's wallet. And if they stop scrolling, they keep the money. And so it's a very simple process of, of rewarding them for basically stopping paying attention to something we hear most of them want to do anyway. And also don't find motivation to do it. So really we're just the motivation to something that we think human behavior is, is interested in. But the technology has stolen from us.

Hillary Wilkinson: (09:16)

My brain's kind of, buzzing as you're talking to me. Last night I went and saw the AI documentary. Yeah. And, um, one of the big topics being bandied about in the land of, you know, those who create AI, those who wanna figure out how we live alongside the creation of this new technology is, um, the importance of human agency. The importance of being able, you know, how to decide how you want choice, basically free will. Right. And so this, I'm I'm hearing that it actually is, um, rewarding kids for exercising agency. Correct. Which I think that also is a, um, a marketing tool you might wanna use Corey .

Corey Scholibo: (10:11)

It's a good line actually. Yeah.

Hillary Wilkinson: (10:12)

You might want to capitalize on we have to teach our, yeah. Ourselves and our kids how to embrace agency mm-hmm . And embrace these, these ways of behaving. And this is a, this is a, um, a friendly way to start it out. On your website there's something I, I just kind of poked around and there's like day O deals and there's, so are you setting like a set monetary amount? Can you just kind of break down a little bit?

Corey Scholibo: (10:55)

Absolutely. How does it actually work? Yes. So it's pretty simple. Um, you have, uh, it's, we call them a deal because it, you're setting a deal. And I think as parents, you're making a deal, right? You've made a deal your whole life. If you finish your dinner, you can have dessert. If you do your homework, you can go outside. You've been doing deals your whole life; you just maybe don't think about them as deals. You probably use the word, Hey, I'll make you a deal, right? So we're like, why wouldn't you make a deal on this? Um, you know, similarly, you don't mow the lawn for the good of the family. You do it for your allowance, right? Or at least I did. I didn't do it 'cause I felt like the lawn should look beautiful. I did it 'cause I was getting an allowance.

Corey Scholibo: (11:27)

And so that's why we call it sort of allowance in the age of screen time. But the deals are, um, fully customizable. So you decide how many minutes a day, how many hours a day you want your team to use or not use, or what the limit's gonna be. How much money is the incentive? 20 bucks, a hundred bucks, 200 bucks? What is gonna incentivize your teen? The time limit is gonna be a seven-day challenge, a 30-day challenge. Ultimately, we hope people just set this as like a monthly allowance and sort of make this part of their, their parenting. Um, and then you choose the apps as well, very customizable. So it's not an all or nothing. Let's say you want your kid on the Khan Academy app, but not on YouTube. You can choose just YouTube and leave those apps open. And also a lot of kids need their phones for school or other reasons.

Corey Scholibo: (12:10)

So it's a hundred percent customizable. It's a subscription-based service. You set the deal, you send it to your teen, your teen accepts the deal, proves that they have added those apps, which there's a, there's a proprietary system that checks that so that they can't cheat it, um, proves that they've selected those apps. And now you and the teen are connected on those apps specifically. You don't see what they're scrolling. Um, there's no spying, there's no, 'cause teens won't handle that either. It's just the overall time of the day. You'll see a bar that tells you, okay, you set two hours today and your teen's at an hour and a half or an hour. Um, and it'll tell you there's a monthly calendar or, uh, that'll tell you, whether they did well or poorly that day, which I actually really like because let's say one day they did do really badly, you know, they were over, like maybe they went four hours over or something.

Corey Scholibo: (13:01)

You could then go and talk to them about it. You could then go and say, Hey, you know, maybe they broke up with their girlfriend. Maybe they're, they lost the, the play or something, I don't know. And, and now you kind of know, otherwise it's just like a vacuum. I don't know how much time they're on their phone. Um, and so it's this transparent system so there's no more arguing. You know, you both know you made a deal, you both know what's going on, and you also don't have to argue if they go over right. They just lose the money. You've taken the agency out of you yelling and saying, well, you didn't want the a hundred bucks. It'll come back to my wallet. You as the parent can then do another deal next week, next month, take the money back out, buy something yourself in our marketplace. So it's a real two-way system with both loss and reward as the psychological techniques.

Hillary Wilkinson: (13:43)

Okay. When we come back, I'm going to ask Corey a few more things about Dayo and how to deal with kind of motivational burnout. 

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I'm speaking with Corey Scholibo, the CEO of Dayo, an app that uses financial incentive to keep kids off of devices. So just, um, real life moment here. Yeah. Where I ran the dayo model past my teen. Yep. Their response was, so now you're just bribing kids to stay off of phones. . Okay. And I gotta, Ima I do, I did not have a ready response. Yeah. But I was like, oh, I know who I'm going to talk to. And maybe you can answer that question. Is this just bribery?

Corey Scholibo: (14:31)

Well, I mean, I guess the question is, what is bribery, right? I mean, are you bribing your kid? Do you, do you pay your kid an allowance to clean the room? To wash their dishes? To do chores around the house?

Hillary Wilkinson: (14:42)

Oh, you're asking me specifically? Yeah. Uh, no. We have kind of set groundwork of, we're a team. We live here together, we take care of common areas. Yeah. And then we do have extra add-ons. Yeah. So if you have, you know, if you, if you clean the chicken coop, I will pay you. So,

Corey Scholibo: (15:00)

So is that bribery? I guess that's my question. Okay. You know, are you bribing your kid to clean the chicken coop? I get the point. And I, and fast company actually covered us and, and actually wrote, you know, this teen is bribery. And I was like, ah, they use the word bribery, but then a lot of people I was talking to were talking about how that's sort of clickable and kind of viral in a way that's interesting. I don't know. There's an argument here between parents, um, and there's a lot of, what I hear is a lot of like, “well, if it's bribery, I don't wanna participate.” And like, well, what do you, what's your game plan then? Like, so you're just gonna keep going with this negative aspect, or you're not gonna try a technique that that actually works because you feel sort of morally disaligned from it, which is totally fine.

Corey Scholibo: (15:36)

There's lots of different ways to parent. The majority of parents I think don't have the time or the wherewithal to like go take a course or, there's so many wonderful parent educators and influencers that are teaching 30-day courses, 13-day courses. They have these packages, these programs. And I think a lot of parents don't have the time to do that. So I think it comes down to whether you consider allowance bribery; I think of it more like allowance. Anytime you would do a positive behavior, you could potentially get rewarded for it, um, in my household at least. Um, so, you know, I think it's up to every parent to decide, but I don't really think the word matters as much as does it work?

Hillary Wilkinson: (16:11)

Okay.

Corey Scholibo: (16:11)

Okay. Would your teen do it and would it work for them?

Hillary Wilkinson: (16:14)

So it's a semantics kind of a thing.

Corey Scholibo: (16:16)

I mean, to me it is, if you have a moral, then this is not the right app for you. Right? Yeah. And there's a, there's a, there's multiple groups of parents. You know, there's, um, as I've learned, um, you know, you've got different camps on both sides of this, but you also have different camps on like the Jonathan Haidt side of things. Like once I started meeting some other parent groups, they're like, oh, we don't subscribe to that. Like, that is the doom and gloom scenario isn't even real. Read the project, the Harvard Project Zero study, and you know, if you read the Harvard Project Zero study, there's a small percentage of teens, like 8% or something that has no effect that can use as much as they want. And there's no psychological effect on them. This is not a oh, an all-or-nothing situation here.

Corey Scholibo: (16:51)

There's a broad spectrum as like you just said, one of your teens is motivated by money. One of them isn't one technique for one, one technique for another. And so to me, this is just a tool that breaks the trance. These teens, when we talk to teens, the main thing we hear is that they were looking, they started looking at their screen time again because there was some reason to now because there was some incentive on the table. What happens from there? This app does not proclaim to be the answer to a parenting solution to mental health problems. We don't tell you to go meditate. All we are is about getting your screen time down and, and using a proven technique to do it from there, you then can parent and decide to go to the fair or go on hikes together or play family games together. That's not my job. My job is to get your team to stop scrolling and pay attention

Hillary Wilkinson: (17:37)

And even just build awareness because with awareness then comes intention. Correct. So, yes. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, the other thing that I, uh, like when I just looked at it, my kind of putting on my motivational studies hat. Yeah. Um, I feel like many parents and teachers at different points have employed what are called token systems for rewards, uh, behavioral rewards. Whether it's like, you know, a sticker chart for keeping your room clean or, you know, Popsicle sticks in a jar to tally how many books were read over summer. Mm-hmm . The coloring sheet. I mean, holy moly, even our dentist has a page for coloring in the nights that you floss, you know? Yep. There's all these tracking devices, right? Yep. And I, it's my experience that these all start out great. Yep. The challenge with token system management, if you, if you're focusing on extrinsic reward rather than intrinsic value mm-hmm . Um, is that there's often this big upswell of compliance and enthusiasm and desired behavior at the start, but then the enthusiasm wears off, and the novelty grows thin. So do you have, like, is there anything that Dayo has that deals with this dwindling motivation?

Corey Scholibo: (18:52)

Well, I mean, the psychologist that was quoted in Fast Company, which we did not employ, um, was talking about how this really will work. Um, but there could be a long-term need to up the ante, right? Mm-hmm. So you might have to increase the rewards in order to make it seem more incentivized. I do think though, with money, the cool thing about money is that it takes it out of all the extrinsic like stickers and, and all that is great. And I think if we'd had an app that was just giving people gold stars, people would be like, oh, this is cool, nice and everything. But again, what's the long-term adaptability? Are they gonna stay with it? Your kid is going to need and want money forever. They're going to need, want to go to the movies, they're going to want to save for college.

Corey Scholibo: (19:32)

Maybe they want to invest, you know, we're building a FinTech platform so that teens can really, this is just the opening gambit, but ultimately we want teens to learn time, money management. Yeah. We want them to learn how to invest. We want them to learn how to save for college. We want them to learn how to that, that they're giving away all of this to these tech companies and getting nothing in return for it. And you're getting rewarded for doing it. So, you know, I think that remains to be seen what those numbers are. And it will vary from person to person. Just like your teen may be at six hours a day on social media or screen time, you may need to start at five and a half. And that may, and that may be a win, or you might start at two and that may be a win.

Corey Scholibo: (20:08)

Like, I don't know what's going on in your, your teen's life. So it's really, the idea is to make it as customizable as possible so that you can keep changing the reward structures. And there's a whole lot coming, challenges and leaderboards and maybe the, the teens get together and challenge each other as a group. Um, we've talked a lot. A lot of teens have said, have my parents doing it at the same time, which you can do. At the same time, the parents can also use this app and reward themselves with, with our Dayo dollars. Um, but maybe they, they had a swear jar idea, like maybe that when the parents go over they pay the kids even more. So you could create these really sticky, synergistic systems in the home that hopefully in my dream, you sit down at dinner and your kid actually says, “Hey mom, I did 30 minutes better than you today”, not the other way around. Mm-hmm

Hillary Wilkinson: (20:51)

. Mm-hmm . And so, um, just to be clear, and I think this does tag into what you're talking about with, um, knowing your audience and who, like what is going to motivate them. The, can you, do you have a specific age range that Dayo’s best designed for?

Corey Scholibo: (21:09)

We believe that this picks up, and again, we're learning as well. Um, we believe that this picks up where the blocking apps stop, right? So let's say your probably the day your kid gets a smartphone is one of the first ones. I think when your kid gets social media, which is another argument, right? Some people are 11, 13, 16, never , don't give your fa kid a phone, et cetera. So this is all different for parents. So, but most kids are getting a phone around 11, 12. Most of them are getting on social media pretty closely around that time. Um, we've also seen from Australia, for instance, that the bans didn't really, they're not really working. I think they're great, um, as a concept, but kids are finding their way around it, et cetera. Again, you can't ban your way out of it. You've gotta get them buy-in from the teens. So we consider this to be a post-adolescent, you know, preteen to teen app that sort of takes the kids from, I would say 13 to 18, just from a marketing perspective, but it could be as young as 11. I have seen a lot of parents using it with the iPad. So I have seen parents using it for 10 and 11-year-olds. Okay. It's actually easier because the money's a lot less. They think $20 is a lot of money when they're 10. Um, but I, I think this is a teen app.

Hillary Wilkinson: (22:17)

Oh, okay. Okay. And just to be totally clear, and I don't know where Dayo stands, but Healthy Screen Habits recommends putting off smartphone internet-connected devices till at least 13. And we recommend putting off social media until 16. Like, think of it like driving a car.

Corey Scholibo: (22:33)

Totally, totally agree.

Hillary Wilkinson: (22:34)

And so, um, yeah, and I, I, I understand and I have read those same studies about, uh, the Australia ban struggling, but I think the power of public messaging Yes. Is one that we can't ignore. Yeah. And the one that like, parents have a platform to stand on, it's kinda like PG 13 movies mm-hmm . Right? Mm-hmm . And so it's at least something that gives parents guidance as well as teeth. So

Corey Scholibo: (23:01)

Oh, I absolutely agree. I just think if parents are thinking it's gonna save them, it's, it's, you, you got more , you're gonna be surprised.

Hillary Wilkinson: (23:09)

. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So that actually leads right into my next question, which was I was gonna ask, can Dayo take the place of parental controls?

Corey Scholibo: (23:20)

I mean, I think it does at a teen level. I mean, this is a question for parents, right? At what point is your teen no longer gonna tolerate you controlling their phone? And I think that's a parental conversation. Some teens it's early, some teens it's later, you know, around 16. If they're driving around, are you really telling them how long they can be on Instagram and controlling their phone from your phone? Um, parental controls, I, I think all of this is a personal question for parents, and I don't presume to know what's right for any parent or teen. All I'm trying to do is offer a tool for those who are struggling, um, or who wanna layer this into their own parenting model. So to me, if you're, if you're cool with your kid having a phone at 13 and you wanna, then layer this on top of it so you can have an incentive structure to teach them time, money management, great. If you wanna do this at 16, then do it at 16. 'cause you were, didn't give your kid a phone till they were 16 or didn't give your kid social media till they were 16. Um, again, while we support all of these me measures and methods, we're kind of agnostic to which one works for your family. I'm just a tool. Um, I'm helping to help you do what you want to do and how you want to parent better.

Hillary Wilkinson: (24:29)

Mm-hmm . Gotcha. So we have to take another short break, but when we come back, I'm gonna ask Cory Scholibo for his healthy screen habit. 

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HSH website

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I'm speaking with Corey Scholibo from Dayo, the app for families who wanna build better digital habits without constant conflict. So Corey, on every episode of the Healthy Screen Habits podcast, I ask for a healthy screen habit. And this is going to be a tip or takeaway that listeners can put into practice nearly immediately into their own home. Yeah. What's yours?

Corey Scholibo: (25:25)

Well, obviously I use deo, but, um, the thing that works for me because I, you know, I, I built this product originally for me because I'm addicted as anyone else. Like I've got on TikTok finally. And it's, it just crazy. Like I wanna look at it all day. Um, for me, I have to delete the apps. I mean, and it's not, it's, I know it's sort of obvious. I'm sure other people say it, but I have to delete them even if I have to download them again later for work purposes. If I really, truly want to. Sometimes I can brick them in my house. I use Brick sometimes. I think that's a good tool. Um, but I have to just delete TikTok. If I delete TikTok and Instagram from my phone, I just don't look at them as much. It's quite proven that we do it on the phone differently than we do it on the screen.

Corey Scholibo: (26:03)

And if you read like the, um, stolen focus, he suggests like, if you wanna look at Instagram, great, fire up your computer and look at Instagram, you won't make it more than 20 or 30 minutes. Um, so to me it's about deleting the apps and, and it's really difficult because we're in a company where we're trying to tell the story and we're having to use the interwebs to do it. And so I'm actually sometimes on my phone more than I was because I'm telling the story through social. We always say we might have to go to the bar to get the drunks out of the bar, which we do. Um, so it's a real struggle 'cause it's hard to delete TikTok and get back on your account and, and it's like login issues and so on. So, I don't know. I I think just delete it, like, just stop, um, is my technique, but that's not for everybody.

Hillary Wilkinson: (26:47)

Yeah. Yeah. Building in some friction, like really helps

Corey Scholibo: (26:51)

Building in friction. Yeah. Any friction is good and that's what we're based on. But yeah, I think any of these tools, I think all of these tools need to be used together to frankly, as much friction as possible. We live in a too frictionless world.

Hillary Wilkinson: (27:00)

Yeah, I agree. And then when I try and instill some friction into my life, I don't like it. as it turns out, I'm a big wimp .

Corey Scholibo: (27:11)

Yeah. And it's hard because, you know, parents have so much friction. Anyway, it's, it's like my issue with Amazon or using Amazon, I'm like, well, they're like, well, it's so easy, and I'm so busy. And I'm like, I get it, man. You don't maybe have the time to go to DoC websites for six different things. And I do maybe sometimes do, but um, you know, we decide what our val what our, what is worth that time and, and whether we can do it. And I think, you know, this is a place where we have to put friction in. Yeah. There isn't going to be a quick fix to this problem.

Hillary Wilkinson: (27:39)

Yeah. And Corey, did you wanna talk about, um, the offer you were gonna offer listeners? Yes. For having made it all the way through the episode,

Corey Scholibo: (27:46)

If you've made it all the way through this episode, we're going to offer your listeners a free month. Um, it's a seven-day trial, a free trial for anyone who wants to try it right now. But we'll give you a code, which is HSH, and, um, you just go into Dayo and when you're ready to do the subscribe button, which we'll ask you to do if for the deal, um, just put in code HSH and you will be able to get a free month.

Hillary Wilkinson: (28:07)

Wonderful. I'll include that link in the show notes. And as always, you can find a complete transcript of this show if, uh, you would like to revisit it, as well as that link for more info about Dayo and the code. So you do all of that by going to healthyscreenhabits.org, click the podcast button and find this episode. Corey, thank you very much for being here today and for the work that you've, you do and have done in all kinds of problem-solving.

Corey Scholibo: (28:40)

Thank you for having me and for all your listeners. We see you, we hear you. We're, we're working to help you. If we can find solutions.