S5 Episode 7: A Gen Zer Talks About Social Media // Cece Hawley of Live More Screen Less Youth Council

“I think the general trend [surrounding technology] that I've always seen with adults in my life has been that they don't know what the rules and boundaries should be…”

- Cece Hawley

Healthy Screen Habit Takeaway

Resources

For More Info:

https://livemorescreenless.org/

Show Transcript

Hillary Wilkinson (00:07):

Live More Screen Less is a Minnesota-based organization using best practices from education, public health, and positive youth development to engage with families, schools, and organizations, all in the interest of promoting balanced and intentional use of technology. So we all know I am all about internal and external balance. I've been missing my yoga practice lately and I'm all outta kilter. I also firmly believe in living all areas of life with intention, especially surrounding technology and healthy screen habits. So one of the cool things about Live More Screen Less is they have a youth council, and I'm so excited today, we have the president of this council. Welcome to the Healthy Screen Habits podcast. Cece Hawley!

Cece Hawley (01:01):

Thank you so much. It's great to be here.

Hillary Wilkinson (01:04):

Yay. I'm so glad we connected as a third-year student, which looks like maybe a few majors. Do you have<laugh>? 

Cece Hawley (01:11):

Yes. Uh, I'm double majoring in French, Spanish, and Psychology with a minor in Global Engagements.

Hillary Wilkinson (01:18):

Oh my gosh, yes. So you've got, you've got multiple majors and a minor plus you've got two jobs on campus. I saw. And president of the youth council. I'm like amazed. You have time to breathe, so

Cece Hawley (01:30):

Sometimes Me too <laugh>.

Hillary Wilkinson (01:33):

So let's spend just a minute having you explain a little bit more in detail what live more Screen Less is like how did it all come to be?

Cece Hawley (01:42):

Yeah, it's a, it's actually a really great origin story. Um, I was approached by KK Myers and Marie, um, back in 2020 of March I believe, or April. So before anything about the pandemic. And they came and approached me, um, asking if I'd be interested in promoting this thing called Digital Wellbeing. And I had no idea what it was. I was very interested in getting involved because the way that they described it to me was that the mission was to promote balance of technology all driven by the youth. Um, so what really made it important to me is that it was being driven by my peers and myself and not something that's being more commanding from an adult standpoint. Um, so when I heard about this, I thought it was a great idea. It wasn't a fully fledged idea yet, but I wanted to get on board and, um, my, one of my friends was also part of it. So we were the first two youth council members and it started to grow with, um, a few more peers from different schools and ranging backgrounds. And it came to a point where I kind of stepped up as a leader and became the president of the youth council, where I would basically just serve as a liaison between the co-founders and the other youth council members working on projects such as making slide decks, joining video calls, talking with senators. Um, but that's pretty much an abbreviated version of the origin story.

Hillary Wilkinson (03:10):

Okay, great. So do you guys, um, does, do you collaborate with other schools or is it specific to the university that you're at?

Cece Hawley (03:20):

Um, actually we collaborate mostly with high schoolers. Um, so I just happened to be in college now. I did join in high school and the idea that it finally turned into was promoting digital wellbeing through a program. Um, so I have been certified by taking I believe, three, three hour long, um, sessions, learning about the physical wellbeing, the mental, cognitive social wellbeing, um, and its connection to technology. And with that, now that I am certified, I can go into other high schools and kind of put that into a curriculum, which is one of the big things that I was able to help, um, gain, is we were able to secure $1 million of funding from the government to kind of upstart this program.

Hillary Wilkinson (04:05):

Excellent. Awesome. Okay. So this season I'm doing this like focus on social media and part of the reason why I really wanted to chat with you and get your take on it is because as a Gen Zer, I kind of feel like you are all on the ins and outs of, um, social media. And after this break we'll hear all about it.

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Hillary Wilkinson:

Cece Hawley is the president of the Live More, Screen Less Youth council, a group that's brimming over with creativity and passion for creating a world of digital wellbeing for all. So ce there is so much news in the news rather about social media, how it can harm teenage girls, but also like how it can build community, but mostly how it's lacking guardrails to protect young people. And I feel like your generation is truly patient zero on the social media front, like for better or for worse, it's just how it worked out. So I think if we could like kind of back it up and I'd just like to take it from this kind of like huge perspective of you're talking to, you know, your fundraising millions of dollars and you're, you're speaking with senators and I just would like to kind of like bring it right down to you and back up for a minute and ask how old were you when you first started a social media account?

Cece Hawley (06:13):

Um, I got my first phone as a fourth grader. It was a flip phone, so it was pretty much only texting and calling my parents. Um, when I did move into more of a middle school phase, I believe like sixth grade, fifth grade is when I did start my Instagram account. I had an older sister and she is about two years older, so she kind of was already in that realm with using social media. And uh, my first social media account was Instagram. And uh, going into that at a young age, you really don't know what it is. And also I don't think anyone at the time knew how big of a thing it would be. Um, so I was, I was probably around sixth grade when I first got it.

Hillary Wilkinson (06:55):

Okay. So in the house that you grew up in, what was kind of like the vibe around tech? Did you guys have rules or was it, it sounded like you had an older sibling. Were you guys figuring it out together? Like how, how, what was the structure around it in your house?

Cece Hawley (07:10):

I think the general trend that I've always seen with adults in my life, um, has been they don't know what the rules and boundaries should be. So at the time it really wasn't anything for me. Um, and I, thankfully it wasn't a huge issue per on my own individual. Um, but I have seen it affect my siblings a lot with the way that they use technology. Um, and I can even see it in like schools with the way that we, we literally had iPads and, um, laptops in my school and there are still not many boundaries written down because no one really knows what it's like to have everyone having a social media account and technology

Hillary Wilkinson (07:52):

Mm-hmm. <affirmative> mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Yeah. It's all become very conflicted with all these, you know, the different platforms and streaming and everything else. And, um, so I'm just wondering, I, I feel conflicted about social media because there are parts of it that I love. There are parts of it that allow us to instruct and educate and build awareness and things like that. And then there are other things that I deeply wish would go away <laugh>. And, and so I'm kind of wondering like from, from a a Gen Zer perspective, what are your views on social media? Like how do you feel about it?

Cece Hawley (08:32):

Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, as I've grown older, it's definitely been more of a nuanced thing for me. Um, at a certain point I thought it was completely negative and a certain point I thought it was super positive. Right now, I think it is more in the conflicted realm just because I do enjoy seeing what my friends are up to. I do enjoy kind of having my own place where I can post and show what I've been up to. Um, there's obviously negative aspects that affect me and I've tried to take steps to help out with it, such as I don't, I have this setting where you can't see how many numbers of liked you have. And I also have the setting of, um, my notification for Instagram turned off. Um, because I learned that when I post a photo, I get very anxious about how many people are interacting with it in the first minute, how many are now after 10 minutes. So I've taken few steps about it and I mean, one could say, why don't you just delete the app? And it can be very difficult for specifically people my age because this is a way of life right now. Sure. With communicating, learning about things, I mean, every single club on campus has an Instagram account to show about events mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Um, so I would say it's far more difficult than just deleting it.

Hillary Wilkinson (09:50):

Oh, for sure. I mean, people run whole businesses off of it. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, it's a, you know, so I think it's, it's become this thing that is far greater than anybody ever dreamed a photo sharing app. And then that's only Instagram. Like do you have Snapchat as well? Do you?

Cece Hawley (10:05):

I do. I I'm very involved with many social media apps. So I have Snapchat, um, I have the new one that's called Be Real. I'm not sure if you've heard about it. Yes. And I do even consider LinkedIn as a, as its own social media platform.

Hillary Wilkinson (10:17):

Yeah. Yeah, sure. No one could argue that any user generated content is social media. So I mean, that includes YouTube or, you know, so it, it's, yeah. So that's interesting. Okay, so let's talk about influencers. Cause I find this very interesting, this kind of delineation between what, like can you define for me, because I can't figure out what makes an account like popular versus what makes an influencer account? So I'm, I guess I'm looking for a definition because I don't know, and I'm wondering if you could shed some light <laugh>

Cece Hawley (10:58):

<laugh>. That's definitely a good question. It's making me think a little bit more. Um, probably for a definition of what makes an account, an influencer account would just be a larger following, um, a larger following that can affect many different people. Um, like I would never say I'm an influencer with number one, the amount of people that I interact with on social media and the reach that it gets. Um, for example, with TikTok with people who have the algorithm where they're able to post something and it immediately goes out to millions of people and they start growing and growing more. I would say that's obviously an influencer. But, um, I'm not sure if that's an entire definition, but that's what I have for you right now.

Hillary Wilkinson (11:46):

<laugh>. Yeah. Yeah. Well it's just, it's interesting cause it seems like there's this shift that goes from like positive or not positive, but popular that goes from popular account. And then I, I don't, my definition when somebody asked me about it was I thought it was like the point at which maybe their content started becoming monetized. Mm. But I don't, I don't even know if that's accurate. So I thought I would ask someone like you!! <laugh>

Cece Hawley (12:17):

I think, I think it's a really great, um, border there, It's just difficult now that there's so many different like sides of social media where like there's influencers who cook or influencers who talk about movies. Um, it's just difficult when Yeah. Like some of them aren't monetized, but they have a large following and influence so many people.

Hillary Wilkinson (12:38):

Right, right. So maybe that's just, um, see that's why I needed to talk to <laugh> to you because I'm, I'm trying to apply my, uh, Gen Xer values of like, well, it needs to be a moneymaking platform. Okay. So, um, so someone like you, you're clearly, I mean, highly involved at a university, et cetera, et cetera. That being said, do you think that influencing is becoming more acceptable as a career choice?

Cece Hawley (13:09):

I do think so in the way that it's just becoming more normalized. I, I, from the way that I've talked with a lot of my peers here, I think a lot of them feel the same way in that it's, it makes sense that you can make money, so why wouldn't you do that? But none of them are ever like, I would say chasing for that type of job or career choice. Um, at least the circles that I'm surrounded by. Um, but I do think it's definitely become more acceptable and more understood compared to what it was like two years ago even.

Hillary Wilkinson (13:42):

Sure. I mean, it's been fast. Right. And I think, I think, I mean, everything about the pandemic just was kerosene on tech for, you know, I mean doing video calls to everything. I mean, prior to the pandemic, I think I'd been on maybe a few video calls and now it's like the only thing we ever do <laugh>. So.

Cece Hawley (14:03):

Exactly. And it's just so interesting to see because I think a lot more kids are growing up with the idea of that being a career choice or maybe an aspiration even, and seeing how that's affecting like my younger siblings, I'm not saying that they want to be influencers, I don't believe they do, but just the way that influencers have that effect on kids, the way that most influencers are in their young twenties doing lots of things, being able to buy lots of clothes and seeing that effect my younger siblings dressing in a way that I never did at that age, because they have that access to other adult people to look up to.

Hillary Wilkinson (14:39):

Right, right. Yeah. So yeah, there's never kind of like, you know, I'm going to use the phrase “better teacher”, but that's not, I'm not, not like putting a value on that, on that term better. I'm just saying like, there is no teacher for kids than a kid than a kid or someone a, you know, young adult that's just a little bit older than them. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> and I, I feel like every parent would know what I'm talking about somehow. Like an eight year old could teach my six year old how to tie their shoe way better than I could <laugh>, you know, after though I tried and tried and tried and all it took was like one, one child coming who was just a little bit older than them. It's like they speak a different language. So Yeah. So knowing this, it's also, I'm totally recognizing that this is like your current super superpower <laugh> because

Cece Hawley (15:32):

Exactly! That has a lot of merit to it. I mean, I think that's a huge reason why I was interested in Live More and being that youth advisor because, um, I've already noticed it with my siblings again. Like they just, they can hear more coming from someone closer in age.

Hillary Wilkinson (15:46):

Totally. Totally. So how do you, knowing that, and knowing we don't have you in our back pockets, <laugh> all over, all over the country here, how, um, how do you recommend talking to our kids about like sensitive subjects, like explicit content or creepy people, you know, I mean clearly predators, but I mean, without, how, how do you recommend approaching those topics without them kind of just being like, “Ugh, mom!”?

Cece Hawley (16:22):

Yeah, that's a really, really good question because I can remember back in the day when I was a kid too, um, me saying back in the day, but being few years ago. But, um, it's hard to reach that balance. And I think the largest thing is just being really, really candid and saying, “I understand that this is a time where so many people connect through texting, connect for social media, but truly there are steps you need to take to be safe. And, um, if that we have trust for you and we want to trust you, but remember that, um, at any point we, if you step over that line, we need to take precautions to keep you safe.”

Um, I think as a kid, just knowing that I am trusted, but also knowing that I need to be safe for myself because it can be a fun thing, but also a very scary thing. Knowing that there is a boundary there and knowing that my parents do have my back, I think would be the best way to go about it.

Hillary Wilkinson (17:20):

Okay. That's, that's good advice. Just so, um, just so any of our Healthy Screen Habits listeners are clear, we do not believe <laugh>, I know that this, I this may not reflect Cece’s, um, views at all, so I'm going out on a limb here, but we at Healthy Screen Habits do not believe that any middle schooler belong on social media. So we firmly wait, believe on waiting for social media. When we come back, I'm going to ask CE for her healthy screen habit.

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Hillary Wilkinson:

My guest today is the president of the Live More Screen Less Youth Council. She speaks three languages and her favorite dessert is chocolate cake. So speaking of dessert, this is the last little bit of each episode that's just that!  It's the part that you kind of get to enjoy and hopefully employ a few in your own life. CC as you know, on each episode, I ask my guest for a healthy screen habit. This is a tip or takeaway that people can put into use in their own home. Do you have one for us today?

Cece Hawley (18:45):

I do. Um, in general, I think it's one of those things where you are using social media or anything for your own joy. I think if something isn't giving you joy, if a photo does give you joy, you should post it. And if it doesn't give you joy, delete it. Um, I think it's one of those things you just have to always remind yourself that these things were created for you and it's up to you to take your steps on how to reclaim that and make sure that it's adding to your joy rather than taking away.

Hillary Wilkinson (19:18):

Yeah, I like it's, it's that maintenance of that intentional purpose that you guys kind of circle back again and again too. So I, I thought your healthy screen habit reflected that. So as always, a complete transcript of this episode as well as links to any of the resources mentioned can be found in today's show notes. You can find these on healthyscreenhabits.org, click on the podcast button and use the dropdown menu to find this episode. Cece, thank you so much for being here today, and thank you even more for the important work that you're doing as part of the youth council and all of the education that you're giving to kids just a little bit younger than you, cuz we all know they're gonna listen to you a lot more! <laugh>

Cece Hawley (20:07):

Thank you so much for having me.